« Reply #7 on: Apr 29, 2019, 11:25 pm »
 
could the skirt feed holes on the [TS3] bow be blocked off/reduced in size and larger holes at the rear and along the sides, could then a divider skirt similar to that of a Sevtec be fitted, instead of the conveyor belt method? 

Sadly, no. The centre of gravity is too far forward, it would need shifting back probably 18" which would be pretty near impossible with the existing hull.
Ian Brooks
Gloucester, UK

« Reply #6 on: Apr 29, 2019, 10:34 pm »
 
So if say for instance a craft with a lift engine mounted on the bow such as the TS3, could the skirt feed holes on the bow be blocked off/reduced in size and larger holes at the rear and along the sides, could then a divider skirt similar to that of a Sevtec be fitted, instead of the conveyor belt method?  Or even an inflatable sausage, would that be better than the conveyor belt?

« Reply #5 on: Apr 29, 2019, 10:18 pm »
 
It's useful to think about how skirts work. We have three types commonly in use:

1 Lift air fed via plenum no divider - often segmented type
2 Lift air fed by plenum with divider - often segmented type with "Bryan White" divider
3 Lift air direct fed to rear compartment with divider. Often Sev type.

Other configurations are possible!

For type 1, any pressure above cushion pressure in the plenum is waste energy. The job of the designer is to reduce theses losses by making all the passageways and holes a large as possible. So I would say less than 1 mBar is desirable, as low as possible to reduce losses.

For type 2, when the bow pitches down, reduced air leakage under the skirt must cause increased pressure in the bow cushion compartment. This can only happen if  the plenum is at higher pressure, so it must therefore be running at a pressure some amount above the cushion. The exact amount needs to be determined by the designer and will depend how much pitch up moment is desirable. So perhaps 1mBar is enough, but more is better - except that this is a loss of lift power so you can't go too far.

For type 3 the bow compartment main air feed is under the divider, and this compartment is designed to run at cushion pressure or less. In normal flight the now compartment runs at a pressure below the main cushion pressure - in the region of half to two thirds. When it pitches down, fron curtain  seals but the divider is still open and the pressure rises quickly to full cushion providing the required pitch up moment.

From these basics it's possible to work out the maths. Type 3 is the most efficient, type 2 is the least efficient but can right a plough in if well designed and type 1 has no ability to right a plough in and is less efficient than type 1.

Incidentally, Kingfisher was a rare beast in that it had a rear fed divider skirt in a segment craft. It worked well, and is the way forward for segment skirts, but the craft must be designed for it at the outset.

Ian
Ian Brooks
Gloucester, UK

« Reply #4 on: Apr 29, 2019, 3:11 pm »
 
Thanks for the advice John  :)

« Reply #3 on: Apr 29, 2019, 2:56 pm »
 
It's got nothing to do with the skirt at all.  The pressure in the plenum is only affected by the wieght, lift power and feed hole area.  If you aren't fitting a divider skirt then open the feed holes until their total area is equal to or larger than the lift fan area.  If you are fitting a divider then load the craft and do the plenum measurement to be 1mBar higher in the feed plenum compared to the cushion.

« Reply #2 on: Apr 29, 2019, 2:06 pm »
 
Perhaps stuff a little cotton "ear bud" type up the tube that is measuring to smooth out fluctuations?. Its really quite interesting measuring at various points, attach to a cane- (or any other item of capital punishment). MY approach with KingFisher was to reduce losses from the highest pressure as it travels thro my lift system. I improved mine by approx 30%  :o
IMHO- doesn't matter what units you measure. What DOES matter is -if you measure 30% losses then---- THATS 30% wasted effort/power/fuel/noise.  ::)
Clear the way for air transfer/movement. Big holes carry more than small holes!  ;)
As ever all IMHO
Memories are BETTER than Dreams---"Capn" FLINT

« Reply #1 on: Apr 29, 2019, 1:24 pm »
 
Another new toy arrived today for me to play with.  Apparently these help to set up the frilly skirt, as the plenum needs to be about 1 millibar higher pressure than under the skirt.  I have no idea if this is correct, be we shall see.  If nothing else I will have actual figures to check against rather than guess work.